[Get Started] Working Alongside Medical Practitioners with Elyse Wagner

Michelle Leotta:
Well hello, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the health coach power community podcast. If you're here live, thank you for joining us. If you're watching or listening to the replay later, happy to have you. Today's a very special episode as part of our get started series. I know when we get started as a health coach, there are so many different avenues of how we can shape our practice. Do you want to start a private practice working directly with your own clients? Do you want to work for a corporation? Do you want to work alongside medical practitioners and there's merit in all of those, but we don't often talk about this idea of working with doctors when it does come up in our group, it comes up as a question. How on earth can I make this work? So today we're going to broach that topic with Elyse Wagner, who is the co-founder of the Functional Medicine Coaching Academy for her unique perspective on how to do just that. So, Elyse, hello, thank you for joining us.

Elyse Wagner:
Hi and hi everyone. Yeah, thank you for having me. I'm super excited to be here with you all.

Michelle Leotta:
We love having you here. I mean, sometimes it becomes an echo chamber of the same voices in the health coach world. So this series has been about like, let's bring in experts, let's bring in voices that aren't always heard within. You know, what's, what's typically sort of the business and marketing health coach communities that are out there. I think this is an important, you know, this is an important topic that I'm not personally not even really able to speak to cause it's not something I've done myself. So, before we even get into the meat of it, can you share a little bit about yourself, your background and about FMCA?

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, FMCA was born about five years ago, back in October and, Sandra Scheinbaum and I got together both as practitioners, Sandy is a clinical psychologist. She also went through the IFM practitioner program. My background is a little bit different. I have a double master's in nutrition and clinical health psychology. So pairing food and mood together and I'll bring it, I'll bring it back to year 2,000. Okay. 2000. I was 13 years old. So you can do the math on how old I, I, but I was 13 years old in 2000 and, short story, but I was, I was overweight. I was about 200 pounds. I was taunted as obese Elyse. I could, I couldn't even imagine that someone could run my name and behold, you know? Wow. But that was, that was one part of it.

Elyse Wagner:
The other part of it was, I, I just didn't like the way I looked and I felt, and I knew intuitively within me that, you know, certain foods and me just did not agree. And I was really curious, that's actually one of my top strengths is curiosity. And I kept wondering like, why? Why do I look super bloated? And why am I so heavy and why, you know, uh, all this happening really to me and, you know, it's so interesting, cause sometimes our biggest struggles and pain points end up being what puts us on our purpose. Right? And my mom, actually who is now as a functional medicine health coach, but was not back then, she really has been my biggest advocate and she helped me to connect with a holistic nutritionist. So back then, you know, 20, some odd years ago, functional medicine was just like really any anybody, I don't think too many people knew about it.

Elyse Wagner:
And so I saw this holistic nutritionist and we literally 180ed my eating lifestyle is always an eating lifestyle. It was always super personalized. And within two months I lost 50 pounds and I realized like, holy guacamole, food is medicine. And I want to share this gift with the world. So now, I set on my journey, but who's going to listen to a 13 year old. Right. And so I actually went, got my undergrad degree in nutritional sciences and dietetics. And I went on to Bastyr and became... got nutrition and clinical psychology - went through that. Three-year masters double master's program while I was in grad school. I was, I believe that was 25 at the time. And I was sick as a dog. My parents wanted to pull me out, uh, of, of grad school. They wanted it to bring me home to Chicago, sweet home, Chicago, take me up to the Mayo clinic, get me tested.

Elyse Wagner:
I went to probably 10 different practitioners and probably a lot of you who are listening could relate to that. If you have... You're walking the journey of a health coach, a lot of you have probably experienced your own personal, you know, health struggles and you know, I'm right in that boat with you. I understand that. And I was here. I was, you know, getting this double master's in nutrition and I have an undergrad degree in nutrition and, and this, master's in psychology and I felt super helpless. I couldn't help myself. I was struggling. I couldn't think straight, you know, everything I put in my body, I like bloated up. I was having some serious body dysmorphia. It was bad. It was bad just mentally, physically, emotionally. And I remember, you know, I said, okay, I'm going to give myself one, one last chance.

Elyse Wagner:
One last shot at health from the functional medicine, holistic integrative side of things, you know, after all I was going... I was living in this Mecca of like holistic health care in Seattle, Washington where IFM is based. So I went and set-up an appointment with a functional medicine doctor. And I remember going into the room and he literally was like, you have celiac disease and autoimmune disorder. We're going to get you tested. Genetically, cause I'd already been tested, uh, with my blood and whatnot. And, and he said, so we're going to figure this out. So, I remember getting into his office and he gave, he said to me, you know, you have celiac disease. And I remember this wave of like relief. Okay. We figured it out. We got to the roots. And then I remember this wave of overwhelmed, like, oh my gosh, this is going to mean like a huge lifestyle change again.

Elyse Wagner:
I've done it before, but this was like 10 times bigger. And I remember that he gave me two pieces of paper to change. And I'm like what? You've got to be kidding me. And I was sitting on my couch, right. So this is now 20... Uh, I don't know, where were we at 2011, uh, sitting on my couch as a rainy day in Seattle as they have many of those. Right. And I remember just thinking to myself, I cannot be the only one struggling with this and I've got this education, I have this knowledge, but how do we really put it into practice? And I just made this pact with, I don't know, universe, whatever, and said, like, I'm going to figure this out. Once I do, I want to take this to the world. I really want to share this with people because we don't need to be struggling like this.

Elyse Wagner:
We don't, we can close the gap. And so, with whole real food and really a positive attitude, I transformed my gut, my health, my life, my perspective, my mindset, and, and fast forward a couple of years later, I met Sandy and we both had very similar visions and passions and created a functional medicine coaching Academy where we now train thousands of coaches. We're very proud of that and we're in collaboration with IFM. So that is kind of my story in a nutshell and how I got here. And, uh, I'll, I'll go a little bit deeper here. When I, when I moved from Seattle as a certified nutritionist and a licensed therapist, I actually... they did not recognize me in the state and the state of Illinois. And because I know my scope of practice and all that, I wanted to stay really clear in my scope of practice and not, you know, do anything that was, uh, not kosher. I'll say that.

Elyse Wagner:
So I kind of took off those hats and I really just started coaching. Right when there wasn't really any sort of, you know, there's not there wasn't the national board there weren't, uh, it was just kind of getting started. And I actually, Sandy, as a clinical psychologist, we connected together and she was seeing patients and, and then she would hand them over to me and I would work with them on lifestyle and coaching. And so we were able to really start bridging the gap between the practitioner and the patient or the client. And we did that through the coach approach and functional medicine and functional nutrition. Anyways, we brought this whole model to, IFM saying, you know, I think we have something here and we want to partner with you guys. So that's a little bit of my background and kind of how we got started with FMCA.

Michelle Leotta:
So many good things in there. Like, I want to jump all over that, like, wow. How did you find someone who's willing to refer their patients to you and form this coach approach, you know, with you? I just think so many coaches are trying to make that happen, but it's difficult. You really need to have a connection to the practitioner in the first place. It sounds like you guys were friends first and had that connection. I, you mentioned IFM a couple of times. Can you just explain what that is for anybody who's listening? Who doesn't know?

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah. So IFM is the Institute for Functional Medicine, so they train, medical practitioners or, uh, I think they have a whole myriad of different types of practitioners that they train, but mostly medical doctors will go to the Institute for functional medicine. Uh, it is located in Seattle, but now everything, all their, courses are virtual. And so, a lot of medical doctors will go through their program and, learn basically the philosophy Baster of functional medicine, learn all the tools that go along with becoming an IFM certified practitioner. And eventually as they go through the modules and become certified, they can now practice in a functional medicine model with their patients or their clients.

Michelle Leotta:
Okay, cool. So it can be confusing cause there's a lot of acronyms talking about this stuff, but IFM, I think of it is like that's for doctors. These are for doctors who want to become functional medicine doctors. They want to be the next Mark Hyman. So IFM exists, if you want to find a functional medicine doctor, I always suggest that you go to the IFM website, that's where you can search find a practitioner. Exactly. I have a friend of mine actually is a psychiatrist. She's going through the program right now, which is super, super cool. But as health coaches, that's not something that we are eligible for. So, what you guys have done have created a coaching Academy that is explain the relationship with IFM because you're the only coaching school that has this relationship.

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah, absolutely. So we have partnered with IFM. So we're collaboration partners. So what that looks like, and what that means is our curriculum is essentially broken up into four main pillars, functional medicine, functional nutrition, positive psychology, and the psychology of eating, and then mind body techniques. We kind of lap those together and it's all encompassing. And the art of coaching, which is based in psychology or humanistic psychology. It's really about looking at what is going well with that person. What's right with you instead of, you know, conventional psychology looks at what's wrong with you. So, we're looking at what's going well, what's going right. And we also bring in, I had talked about curiosity is my top character strength. We bring in character strengths. And we said, the curriculum is really integrated interwoven. Where IFM comes in is that IFM has contributed and, their curriculum.

Elyse Wagner:
So you're learning off of IFM slides. You're learning from IFM faculty, doctors, who everyone is teaching the practitioners you're learning from except we've tailored the slides so that it fits more of the coach. So we're not going into the hard sciences that biochem, the metabolic processes. For me, that's stuff that I totally nerd out and geek out on and I love it. For some people, you know, it's like, Oh, I don't want to know about that. But we really teach you what you need to know so that you can come out of the program and speak the same language as a functional medicine practitioner and also really bridge the gap between the practitioner and their patient. I know a lot of you and I've even been on that side, you know, knowing all that I know as well. Like you get, you get information, you get your lab, work back.

Elyse Wagner:
Your practitioner tells you, you need to do X, Y, and Z. They're really, really good at giving directive that the health coach specifically the functional medicine health coach is really, really great at breaking down less directives into sustainable and realistic goals that align with what's working well and their character strengths. So like, for example, if creativity is one of your character strengths and someone just told, you know, your practitioner just said, Hey, you need to go on the elimination food plan, which is part of, um, one of IFM food plans. So that's another thing as we teach all the IFM, nutritional food plans to our coaches and how to coach to those, with it staying within scope of practice. But let's just say, you know, your practitioner tells you that, well, if anyone's done the elimination food plan, I have, it's, it's a lot to take on.

Elyse Wagner:
And especially to shift and transform if you're going from a standard American diet, let's just say, and so let's say someone's favorite food is pasta. You know, they have an Italian heritage or whatever, and they're like every Friday night I go to my grandma's and that's what we have pasta. She's super, she's Italian. That's what we do. We get together as a family. It's, you know, it's so tied in and that the coach can come in and, you know, really, first of all, listen to that client, meet them where they're at understanding what they're going through. Take the time to really hear them and provide feedback and also to work with them together to, to create some sort of a goal. And, and also to bring in weave in that character, strength of creativity, you know, Hey saw that, you know, creativity is your number one strength. I wonder how we can use that and brainstorm a little bit on finding some fun and different ways to get, um, something similar to pasta, you know, into, into your eating lifestyle while you're honest food plan. So maybe you come up with, you know, sweet potato noodles or the zoodles or whatever. So just, I'm just sharing a little bit of an example there.

Michelle Leotta:
Yeah, that's helpful to see. And I mean, and I think what you're doing is you're explaining how the relationship between a medical practitioner or coach and the client all kind of works together because there's that gap that often happens between, Hey, you have celiac disease, here's two handouts about it. And then a person actually living their life. So I think like this is a real need. It's something coaches are really keen to do. I have met many medical doctors who are also keen to have coaches within their practice, but connecting seems to be the hang up. So I'm curious, how are you now? I realize that when a coach graduates from FMCA, they could go on to do anything with their career. But like from where I sit, I feel like your partnership with IFM makes you very well suited for setting coaches up to become partners with functional medicine doctors. So how are you preparing your students to do this?

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah, so it's a great question. And I'll, I'll say a couple things first too. So we have a lot of coaches who've graduated and they will connect with functional medicine practitioners or docs from IFM. A lot of them have also connected with more conventional docs as well, and our traditional, maybe integrative, acupuncturists, dieticians, so other types of practitioners. So my encouragement, and this is something that we really incur. Of course we encourage, you know, if that's the route that you want to go through and connect with a functional medicine practitioner to start building those relationships. I always think of it as ROR, return on relationship instead of ROI, and really starting to reach out into your community and see who is, you know, somewhat like-minded or share similar values to, to you. This is part of what we teach in our business billing track with the functional medicine coaching Academy.

Elyse Wagner:
And then Sandy, also, we have an alumni program as well. So as our coaches leave FMCA, they can continue with us and still stay in community and still have education and support as well. And we have business building workshops that Sandy really works with our grads on to tailor a message or to, uh, Sandy and I both have office hours. And a lot this question gets brought up a lot, like, okay, I graduated now what I have this co this doctor on my radar, I want to reach out to him or her, what do I do? And so we talked through that and, my encouragement for anyone really listening, I, I know that there are Facebook ads and there's Instagram things that you can do. And there's so many people doing so many different things, and I really look at it and I think we do as well as at FMCA, it's really a personalized approach, just like functional medicine is.

Elyse Wagner:
And so I encourage people to make those relationships reach out old school. And that's what I did with Sandy. I mean, I literally found her on the internet. I was like, who's doing functional medicine in Chicago-land area. And Sandy came up and I reached out to her via email. And I actually reached out a couple of times. So bringing in some strength of like perseverance as well, and, you know, uh, picking up the phone, emailing, writing a handwritten note, those are all very tangible things that you can do right now that you know how to already do and, and reach out. I mean, these doctors are busy, um, as well. So, and then having that face to face, you know, connection or setting up that meeting, whether it's virtual or, if you feel comfortable meeting in person now, you know, I encourage you to do so and to, to share, you know, what your value is.

Elyse Wagner:
I think a lot of doctors right now, we're, we're in this funny space, right? Where we have a lot of coaches that are starting to get trained and doctors are now just starting to become educated on, oh, wow, a health coach can really bring a lot of value to me and my practice and my clients. I want to learn a little bit more, and we're doing, we're really working hard at FMCA to educate the practitioners for starters at the Institute for functional medicine to make sure they truly understand how to bring on and work with a coach. So, I'll stop for just a second and see, yeah, see what else.

Michelle Leotta:
It's funny to me, it sounds a little bit like dating. You know, we have the doctors on one side and the coach and everyone's trying to find each other, but it is that relationship that's going to make it happen. Um, until there's some sort of app that lets you swipe and find your perfect match, you're going to have to reach out. And I love the idea of a handwritten note and doing it old school, because that's going to set you apart from just a cold call. And I think that's what most of the time health coaches are trying. There's calling the reaching and office manager. They're not getting anywhere, but you do need to create a relationship with the doctor. So that's awesome. I love that. I love that if you're a graduate of FMCA, maybe there's a doctor, who's a graduate of IFM and then you have something in common right away. That's glorious. When you can say like, Oh, we have this affiliation. Can you tell us a little bit about how board certification is fitting into this whole picture?

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah. So FMCA is a board certified or board approved school through the national board for credentialing health and wellness coaches. It's a mouthful, but, um, we were a founding school with, we call it, we've dubbed it in a quick, so we're a founding school with them. And so after you go through our program, you are eligible to sit for the national boards. And what we're seeing, what we're finding is a lot of, first of all, and I have to, I do have to do a humble brag cause that's okay for a second. I'm very proud of this fact that, just recently we found out that our, we have a 93% pass rate for the board exam, which is above, the, you know, above the curve, I guess. So, we're, we're super proud of that, that we're supporting and really getting our coaches set up to take the board exam.

Elyse Wagner:
So what we're seeing is a lot of coaches who are graduating are maybe who've gone to other programs are becoming board certified. I think that, that, um, there's, there's a reason for that. And so why is that? Well, board certification, it's another step, you know, it's another, um, for a lot of practitioners who are looking for coaches, they want to see, they want to see those coaches who have taken that extra step who have gone and become board-approved or staff for that exam. And so for some corporations I've seen for some practitioners, not all, but some that makes a difference for them. And I think in general, it really elevates the entire health coaching field. So as we start getting into, um, no, right now those who are board approved as of last January, I believe it was 2020. Um, those who are board approved could, uh, sit for the boards, become board approved and then start utilizing category three CPT insurance codes, which is huge.

Elyse Wagner:
And it provides more accessibility. Uh, you know, it's a way to spread, um, you know, health coaching, and there's some really, really exciting news. And I would encourage everyone to go to the national boards website to learn a little bit more about it. But, I believe as of fall 2020, the national board, um, they, they applied for taxonomy codes for health and wellness coaches. And recently they were granted a taxonomy code as of April, I believe April 1st. Which is not, not a full day, um, 2021, where you can start, uh, this will be effective for the industry. And so overall. Um, and for those of you who don't know what a taxonomy code is, it's, it's basically a specific classification, our specification, and, um, so health and wellness coaches are going to have their own taxonomy code, their own NPI number, which is, it's just a big deal. It's a big deal as we are, again, starting to elevate the entire health coaching feel as we've already, um, been able to get this category one or category three, I should say, approval of 40 and flip, you know, hopefully we can move up to category one where, um, you know, eventually health coaches could be licensed practitioners and, um, you know, fully utilizing insurance.

Michelle Leotta:
Wow. Yeah, it is a big deal. It's a very big change and coaches will ask, do I need to become board certified right now? The answer is no, not at all, but if you're someone who's looking to partner with a medical practitioner, yes, it is something that you're going to want to do. And I love that schools like FMCA are allowing you to sit for the exam, pass the exam, get that certification. It's going to allow you to form these partnerships. And the insurance thing is huge because the other reason that I have found it to be like mixing oil and water for the past, over a decade in the field medical establishment, and then the health coaches one's working on an insurance model and one is not, and it's very hard to, to merge the two. But if as a health coach, you're able to bill insurance, that's going to help that collaboration take place. So at least can you think of one or two graduates from, um, FMCA that are actually doing this that have formed some sort of partnership they're working alongside practitioners? We would like to hear some stories about what that actually looks like when it's successful.

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah. So gosh, okay. There's, there's a lot. There's one woman, her name is Rupolly, and she's from Pennsylvania and she comes to my office hours quite a bit. And so she just graduated recently. And, and so in some of our office hours, she'll come up to me or, you know, not come up to me, she'll on mute. Right? And she'll say, you know, I really want to reach out to this practitioner, not quite sure you know, which I do. And so we've worked through that confidence, right? The confidence issue. And, and so recently she just came on and she said, I have a success to share. And what happened was she picked up the phone, set up a meeting with this practitioner. And either, even though it wasn't a quote unquote success in a way that she's going to be working with this person, it led to the next thing.

Elyse Wagner:
It led to an introduction to another practitioner. So she was able to hop on a call, share what she was doing. Um, and also start to kind of talk about like a relationship of what that would look like of referrals or working with a practitioner, you know, on a percentage basis or how were they going to work out the payment. And in the end, you know, it didn't work out, but that she got this referral to another practitioner and now she's getting referrals to this practitioner. So the way it's working out is she has her own practice set up. But now this practitioner is consistently referring people to her, um, practice and, or she might be utilizing, if she's going to be working with people in his practice per se, then she'll get a percentage of whatever that, that is. So, whatever the agreement is that they have, um, agreed upon.

Elyse Wagner:
So that's a huge, huge success in one way to do it. So I just want to highlight that for a second is that you can still have your own private practice and work with multiple different types of practitioners on either referral, or you can work on an agreement where, you know, maybe they're the doctor going to see the patient and you'll see, you know, we call them clients in the coaching world, but you'll see that person as well as a client. And depending on what you guys decide as a split or a percentage, um, you can work out that relationship. Another, um, uh, there's a, a wife and a husband relationships. So the wife is a natural, uh, an ND naturopathic doctor. And she also went through the coaching program. So, she's, uh, a coach and a doctor, and then her husband went through, he's a nutritionist.

Elyse Wagner:
And he went through and became a coach as well. So they're working together and seeing each other's clients or patients and, um, working on all sides of, of the entire person. And you can say, and they also have a gym as well. So they're seeing people virtually or seeing people in person, um, you know, and the safe, uh, format, but there's so many different ways that you can, you know, really use coaching and bring it into your own experience. And I'll even share one experience in my own. And this is Sandy is as well. So Sandy for a long time, um, you know, sat on, she was a psychologist at one of the hospitals in Chicago. And when, uh, I was working with her, we were working with a conventional, um, oncologist in the suburbs of Chicago. And, uh, she had this relationship first, but, you know, she said, she said to him one day, you know, I wonder if your patients would be open to learning different types of breathing and relaxation techniques while there they could use while they're going through chemo.

Elyse Wagner:
And, you know, he was like, huh, that's really interesting. I'd like to learn more about that. So it was like one conversation led to another, which led to, honestly, we had a whole group for over two years meeting on every Friday we would meet. And it was this great community and we'd bring in different topics and, Oh man, it was, it was awesome. So, you know, my encouragement is there is no holds bar, you know, you get to bring in your creativity. Um, and yeah, you need a little bit of boldness and bring out your courage and your bravery to make some of those phone calls, because I know for some people it's not, um, second nature to just pick up the phone and start a conversation, or it can be really scary to do so, but I also just encourage you that there is, if it's not, you know, that person that says, yes, it'll be someone else, you know, um, and you get to share, you know, the value that you bring because that's the one thing I want every health coach to know is that they are so they're invaluable to a practitioner, or a doctor.

Michelle Leotta:
In fact, I've heard so many medical practitioners actually say, I wish I was a health coach. And I'm like, wow, really? Because all health coaches ever say is, Oh, I wish I had more credentials. I wish I had those letters after my name. I don't, I'm not enough. And the doc doctors turning around and going off being a health coach. Sounds awesome. I'd rather do that. So I think there's such an enormous opportunity here, but you do have to have the, you know, what's to pick up the phone or to write that letter and, and build a relationship if it doesn't already exist. Um, anyway, thank you for sharing some of those stories. It sounds like we can, we can reach out, we can find practitioners, we can be referred. We can also just simply marry a practitioner as a mil one example. That might be a little extreme, but I think that's helpful to start to visualize how this mail come together. I know that you have a free specialty course for all of our health coaches today. Can you tell us about that?

Elyse Wagner:
Yeah. So it's called the value of a health coach on a collaborative care team. And I believe we have the link as well that we'll share. And, um, it is a free course. And so in this course, it's, it's 10 minutes. It's literally 10 minutes. You guys could be going on a walk and listen to it. Um, it's Dr. Sandy, she is really sharing, um, seven specific ways on how a functional medicine health coach can add value to a collaborative care team. There is really amazing. Uh, I know a lot of the times we get asked, like I would like to see the research. I want to see the evidence, you know, and especially doctors and practitioners, they like to see the research. So there was really great, um, cited research and trends that are supporting the value of a coach. And this is a great mini little, um, um, you know, class, I guess you could call it or course where it's going to be explained to you. Um, you know, you'll be able to explain to a doctor as you, as a health coach can really elevate their medical practice. So I encourage you to check it out 10 minutes. You can literally listen to it. There's a transcript you can download and read as well, listening and watching. Isn't your thing.

Michelle Leotta:
Okay, awesome. I just dropped that link into the comments here for those of you that are here live, we will put it into the show notes. So if you are listening via podcast, later on, you can go to healthcoachpower.com/podcast, and you'll be able to find this episode and we'll put the link in the show notes there. Cause that sounds like the exact thing that you're going to want to watch if you're intending on forming relationships with medical practitioners. So thank you so much for that, Elyse. That's fantastic. And thank you for being here today. We love hearing from all the different schools and certifications that are available, because sometimes you get your first certification as a health coach, and then a couple of years later, you think, you know what? I really wish could do XYZ, or I really wish I had that board certification or whatever it is. So, this is going to be helpful for our community to be able to take their education to the next level when it's appropriate for them.

Elyse Wagner:
Totally. Yes. And I, um, we have so many students who have gone to other programs and their top strength is love of learning. So yeah, so they want to keep learning and they want to keep expanding and creating a community. So we welcome that. And if anyone asks questions, um, I believe I'm going to be in the groups. I can, I can, um, support, and you're always welcome to head over to functional medicine coaching and, um, even chat with one of our admissions team members, or if you want to chat with a grad as well. So that's available. So yeah, we, we are beyond appreciative of, you know, our FMCA grads, but even beyond that, all health coaches, I mean each and every one of you are making such an impact in the life that you're So, um, touching. And I just, it's, it's such a ripple effect. So I have a tremendous amount of gratitude for all health coaches, because I know you guys are the real boots on the ground doing the work. And I know cause I've been there. It is work. It is, it is a lot of work, but it's so gratifying and it's so rewarding. So anyways, thank you so much for having me on and I appreciate it. Thank you, Michelle.

Michelle Leotta:
It's been wonderful having you. Take care everybody. Thank you for listening. And we'll be back soon with more guests as part of our get started series. You can continue to hear from other voices in the health coaching industry, not just mine. Thanks so much, everybody have a great rest of your day.